When people want to destroy religion they begin by attacking the priest; for when there is no priest, there is no sacrifice: and when there is no sacrifice, there is no religion.
The Church first began at Pentecost; and then the Eucharist was celebrated on a regular basis after that. The people’s first receiving of Christ was by receiving His Spirit. Christ’s Spirit within us is the means by which sanctifying grace flows into us and by which we are empowered as Catholics. This order has not changed. Baptism is the first of the sacraments because of this.
771 “The one mediator, Christ, established and ever sustains here on earth his holy Church, the community of faith, hope, and charity, as a visible organization through which he communicates truth and grace to all men.
763 “The Lord Jesus inaugurated his Church by preaching the Good News, that is, the coming of the Reign of God, promised over the ages in the scriptures
777 “The one mediator, Christ, established and ever sustains here on earth his holy Church, the community of faith, hope, and charity, as a visible organization through which he communicates truth and grace to all men.
Regarding the Holy Spirit’s role in the Church:
767 “the Holy Spirit was sent on the day of Pentecost in order that he might continually sanctify the Church.” Then “the Church was openly displayed to the crowds and the spread of the Gospel among the nations, through preaching, was begun
Catholic ecclesiology asserts both a visible & invisible Church, but the visible Church is related to more or less it’s sacramental economy. Sure, there can be those baptized by desire etc.
However, there is a danger with divorcing The Church as it exists from primarily Apostolic succession & tradition & relying too much on Scripture & the Holy Spirit--that is John Calvin’s ecclesiology more or explained in his Institutes of Christian Religion.
And in that ecclesiology you have the elect and the reprobate rather than members of the body working out their salvation with fear and trembling.
I agree that there is both a visible and invisible Church. Valid water baptism is present even in Protestant denominations, which implies that the Holy Spirit can reside in those outside of the visible Catholic Church even apart from the baptism of desire. In their case, the Catholic Church doesn’t recognize apostolic succession in their visible organizations, but they are definitely part of the invisible Church with their much reliance on Scripture and the Holy Spirit.
“but they are definitely part of the invisible Church with their much reliance on Scripture and the Holy Spirit.”
That is debated among Catholic theologians. Protestants are still referred to as separated brethren, which is polite language for those who are in material heresy, which is distinct from formal heresy. Those who are in material heresy through their baptism could possibly be part of the invisible Church, but the surest way is by way of the Catholic Church and by the means of Catholic sacraments in which a person is infused with sacramental grace.
And this is the importance of the centrality of Jesus who is the prime revealer who reveals the prime revelation. The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father & the Son as a helper--not an oracle of secret knowledge, which is how Calvin viewed the Holy Spirit.
I can only assume that your comments up to this point on Christina’s article is for the purpose of minimizing the importance the ministerial priesthood. I hope this is not the case.
I view the ministerial as another way of describing the governing aspect of the Church by deacons, presbyters, and bishops. The only secret knowledge that the Spirit of Truth speaks is what He hears from Christ (cf. John 16:13-15). Anyone who has the Spirit of Truth and walks in the Spirit is under His influence as a helper for us in many ways.
Fantastic idea! Thank for this suggestion!
The Church first began at Pentecost; and then the Eucharist was celebrated on a regular basis after that. The people’s first receiving of Christ was by receiving His Spirit. Christ’s Spirit within us is the means by which sanctifying grace flows into us and by which we are empowered as Catholics. This order has not changed. Baptism is the first of the sacraments because of this.
What does any of that have to do with the article? Please stop.
What initially motivated my comments was the statement that “without the Eucharist we have no Church”.
Here’s what the Catechism says:
771 “The one mediator, Christ, established and ever sustains here on earth his holy Church, the community of faith, hope, and charity, as a visible organization through which he communicates truth and grace to all men.
763 “The Lord Jesus inaugurated his Church by preaching the Good News, that is, the coming of the Reign of God, promised over the ages in the scriptures
777 “The one mediator, Christ, established and ever sustains here on earth his holy Church, the community of faith, hope, and charity, as a visible organization through which he communicates truth and grace to all men.
Regarding the Holy Spirit’s role in the Church:
767 “the Holy Spirit was sent on the day of Pentecost in order that he might continually sanctify the Church.” Then “the Church was openly displayed to the crowds and the spread of the Gospel among the nations, through preaching, was begun
Define “The Church.”
The Church is primarily those who are filled with the Holy Spirit; although, in the physical organization, there is wheat and there are tares.
Catholic ecclesiology asserts both a visible & invisible Church, but the visible Church is related to more or less it’s sacramental economy. Sure, there can be those baptized by desire etc.
However, there is a danger with divorcing The Church as it exists from primarily Apostolic succession & tradition & relying too much on Scripture & the Holy Spirit--that is John Calvin’s ecclesiology more or explained in his Institutes of Christian Religion.
And in that ecclesiology you have the elect and the reprobate rather than members of the body working out their salvation with fear and trembling.
I agree that there is both a visible and invisible Church. Valid water baptism is present even in Protestant denominations, which implies that the Holy Spirit can reside in those outside of the visible Catholic Church even apart from the baptism of desire. In their case, the Catholic Church doesn’t recognize apostolic succession in their visible organizations, but they are definitely part of the invisible Church with their much reliance on Scripture and the Holy Spirit.
“but they are definitely part of the invisible Church with their much reliance on Scripture and the Holy Spirit.”
That is debated among Catholic theologians. Protestants are still referred to as separated brethren, which is polite language for those who are in material heresy, which is distinct from formal heresy. Those who are in material heresy through their baptism could possibly be part of the invisible Church, but the surest way is by way of the Catholic Church and by the means of Catholic sacraments in which a person is infused with sacramental grace.
And this is the importance of the centrality of Jesus who is the prime revealer who reveals the prime revelation. The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father & the Son as a helper--not an oracle of secret knowledge, which is how Calvin viewed the Holy Spirit.
I can only assume that your comments up to this point on Christina’s article is for the purpose of minimizing the importance the ministerial priesthood. I hope this is not the case.
I view the ministerial as another way of describing the governing aspect of the Church by deacons, presbyters, and bishops. The only secret knowledge that the Spirit of Truth speaks is what He hears from Christ (cf. John 16:13-15). Anyone who has the Spirit of Truth and walks in the Spirit is under His influence as a helper for us in many ways.